In episode 214 of the Disruptors for Good podcast, I speak with Hedvig Alexander, Co-Founder of Powered by People, on bridging the gap between artisans and global buyers through modern technology and tools.
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In an era where consumers demand transparency and ethical production, Powered by People stands out as an innovator in the wholesale industry.
Founded with the belief that the future of wholesale lies in small-batch and responsibly made products, Powered by People connects independent, diverse makers with global markets.
The Mission: Small Batch, Big Impact
Powered by People was created by individuals with backgrounds in retail, design, tech, and international development.
Their mission transcends mere profit-making; it focuses on making a genuine impact by providing sustainable economic opportunities to independent makers.
These makers, in turn, strengthen the lives of their employees, families, and communities, potentially impacting millions worldwide.
Takeaways
- Hedvig's journey from being a Danish army captain to becoming an entrepreneur was driven by her passion for social change and her desire to create responsible, impactful businesses.
- Powered by People is a marketplace that connects buyers in Europe and North America with artisans and makers in Latin America, Asia, and Africa.
- The platform not only facilitates the matchmaking process but also offers financing and resources to help makers become export-ready.
- Cultivating a long tail of makers is crucial for ensuring a unique and attractive supply on the platform.
- Philanthropy plays a vital role in supporting the training and development of makers, as venture capital is not suited for that purpose. Powered by People connects makers with buyers to create a sustainable and unique supply chain.
- Their hybrid financing model bridges the gap between venture capital and philanthropy.
- Information and understanding are key to making the hybrid financing model work.
- The maker community is creating handmade, high-quality products with contemporary designs.
- Powered by People aims to scale the business and become the default sourcing option for sustainable and unique supply.
Vision: Connecting the World to a New Creative Economy
Powered by People envisions a world connected through a new creative economy powered by people. The company’s well-curated, digital wholesale marketplace partners with diverse makers from over 70 countries.
These artisans focus on small-batch production of responsibly made goods, merging heritage-craft techniques with modern manufacturing capabilities.
This blend ensures significant output capacity while adhering to fair-employment and sustainable practices.
Empowering Makers: The Heartbeat of Powered by People
At the core of Powered by People’s success are its makers.
The marketplace features a diverse array of artisans, the majority of whom are women-led, committed to fair-employment and sustainable practices.
The platform provides these makers with access to global markets, financing, and digital tools, enabling them to reach a broader audience and grow their businesses.
By doing so, Powered by People not only supports these artisans but also satisfies the growing consumer demand for ethically produced goods.
Innovative Technology: A Force for Good
Powered by People leverages technology to simplify and enhance the wholesale process. The platform’s innovative tech and financial solutions allow independent brands to easily upload and manufacture their wares.
Retail buyers, in turn, can seamlessly and confidently purchase these distinct goods. By removing the friction from what is often a time-consuming and complicated process, Powered by People takes care of the laborious hassles, allowing buyers and makers to focus on what they do best.
Global Reach and Real-Time Support
Since its launch in June 2021, Powered by People has grown into a global company with team members strategically located in the US, Canada, Kenya, India, Mexico, Turkey, and the UK.
The geographic diversity enables the company to provide real-time support to its community of over 700 maker partners spread across 70+ countries.
This extensive network ensures that Powered by People can continue to expand its community, providing the best support for its maker partners.
The Beauty of Handmade in an Age of Automation
In a world increasingly dominated by automation, Powered by People champions the beauty of handmade products.
The company sees technology as a means to enable human capital, rather than displace it. With offices around the world, Powered by People understands the challenges and complexities that makers face today.
By addressing these challenges with innovative solutions, the company ensures that handmade, ethically produced goods remain at the forefront of the global market.
Transcript of Interview
Grant (00:00.856)
Well, Hedwig, thank you so much for joining me today. Really excited to talk about your interesting journey. You've done a lot of cool stuff so far in your career and your life. And now, powered by people is this amazing sort of network you and your co -founders have built, sprinkling sort of technology on artisans around the world to sort of build this wholesale supply marketplace for retailers, for entrepreneurs building sort of marketplaces.
Hedvig (00:19.231)
Thank
Grant (00:30.078)
via websites, a lot of different things. But basically, now I've been in this, you know, social entrepreneurship impact economy for a decade. And I've been kind of waiting to see something like this, because I think this sort of empowers a lot of future entrepreneurs to get involved in, you know, building drop shipping in an ethical space, let's say I see a lot of drop shipping for just like, you know, Chinese iPhone accessories, right? And that's fine, whatever it might be.
Hedvig (00:57.385)
Yeah.
Grant (00:59.608)
There's, I think there's another way to empower artisans and creators and entrepreneurs for their own ride around the world to give them the innovative technology that they can use as well. So before we start, before we get into Power Ride People, everything it is, the mission and vision, talk about your journey, your career path. How does a Danish army captain become an entrepreneur? What was that path
Hedvig (01:07.209)
Absolutely.
Hedvig (01:22.539)
Yeah. I mean, you know, when you look back, you, it would be tempting, but not true to say that, I planned it all along and it all fits together. But I think, you know, I guess Steve Jobs famous, you know, commencement speech about how the, you connect the dots backward. I think that is true. think, I do think the older you get, you do see that if you kind of follow your passion, I mean, that sounds
to say that, but if you kind of really kind of stay true to what you are interested in and try to make that work with also creating a livelihood and a career, I do think you probably end up this way. And so I always, when I was in university and I went to university a little bit later because I was in the army, I did this degree that started the year I went to university and business school and it was mixing
philosophy with economy. there's this classic Oxford education called politics, philosophy and economy, which is very much about the macroeconomics and society. And this one, the professors at Copenhagen Business School had said, let's do microeconomics because we think that we are, and this is like 20 years ago, 25 years ago, that we are going into a time where there's going to be such big problems in society that we need both business and government to try to solve them together.
And I was so fascinated by that because I always sort of thought there was this public -private sector. You if you really wanted to create responsible, impactful business or anything, this space was really key. And so I think I kind of always felt this way, but I didn't know what that meant and what career would that be. I mean, that wasn't clear to me. that's, had been, when I finished high school, I wasn't sure what to study.
In Denmark, we have a very small army, but we have a big service corps. And so my dad said, why did you do that? I did that when I was your age and I really enjoyed it. It really taught me about leadership. You know, I got to command a lot of people at a young age. And then there was this amazing courses, which most countries actually have, but you, learn the country, the language and the, and the weaponry and the tactics of the enemy at the time and dating myself.
Hedvig (03:47.615)
That was Russia. I mean, we'd just come out the Cold War, but, now it's so interesting that's back now. know, so, so, you know, that's sad that that's has been the case, but so that I was trained in, in intelligence, but with a view to, you know, interrogate Russian prisoners of war, course, according to the Geneva Convention. But, you know, that was the training and it was an, it was an amazing kind of training. And then I got a job at
Grant (03:48.952)
Sure.
It's a bit, yeah, yeah.
Grant (04:06.847)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.
Hedvig (04:13.067)
embassy in Moscow, the Danish embassy in Moscow, and ended up spending a couple of years in Moscow and then went to university late. I started university when I was 24. Really, it's not crazy for a Dane, but I think for North America, it's very rare. So good for me because I felt there was a lot of things I did that I was very, when I finally went, I'm sure you would agree, I knew kind of, I was very serious about it. then I got
Grant (04:21.792)
Me too! Me too! Cool, yeah.
Grant (04:27.234)
Very, very rare. Yeah, very, very, yes, yes.
Grant (04:39.33)
Very focused. I was very focused,
Hedvig (04:42.825)
got the opportunity to work in the public. Once I finished my bachelor's, I went to work for the UN as a military observer in the Republic of Georgia and the caucuses. And then I went to America to study and I studied international relations and that time I'd had all this experience. So I really, yeah, we need to talk after the podcast. anyway, it was a great route for me. so
Grant (04:59.36)
Me too! We're learning so much about each other. Yeah.
Hedvig (05:12.499)
I went to Afghanistan after my degree and I worked for the UN and then ran a couple of charities and really liked my job and was very interested in pursuing, creating this kind of value. I didn't, I just didn't, I think the non -for -profit space is constrained in many ways in the way it raises money. People are often a bit, you know, can be very hard on an NGOs. I think, you know, you know, often people in NGOs, including myself at the time, didn't have a lot of business experience.
which can be hard and then also just the way that the money you raise is structured is not very flexible. if something changes, you know, when we have investors, your investors are like, you can do what you want as long as they have confidence in you and the idea, you can pivot, you can fit the market, as for the NGOs, your hands are kind of tied and the reporting requirements are extremely ominous or even compared to venture investors, you also have to report, but it's in a different way. And so
I really wanted to pursue creating this. really believe in poverty reduction. I really believe in social change, but I, it's like, this is not the right place for me because I always felt as a younger person, I had a lot of responsibility, but I didn't have a lot of authority. And so I couldn't, my ideas, I couldn't get very far with them for lots of reasons. These systems are also a bit more bureaucratic and heavy. And you know, there's lots of reasons for that, you know, but really enjoyed the time, both of these NGOs
and at the UN. And then I married a Canadian who was a diplomat and who wanted to go back and be a politician. And so that's how I ended up in Canada. And that's how I started my first business because I was just sitting, he was running in the South of outside Toronto and I came from like downtown Kabul, which was not particularly downtown, but it was something wonderful and adventurous about it. And suddenly I was in this neighborhood, which is very lovely, but how all the houses look the same. I thought there was only an American movies. And suddenly I'm like,
Grant (06:50.018)
Mm -hmm.
Hedvig (07:11.379)
sitting there with a newborn in my model house in the South Web zone area of Toronto. I thought, my God, what am I going to do? What am I going to do? I really hope love will last. I really hope. And that's how I think, because I think I'm a reluctant entrepreneur. don't know that I had necessarily the confidence, but I was kind of pushed, you know, as many people, think pushed into it. And I met people along the way who really supported me.
Grant (07:24.726)
Love shall conquer all, yeah.
Hedvig (07:41.939)
I guess it's sort of this, yeah, I guess it was this combination of, of wanting to use the driver of business. And, know, and, and the rig, I also learned in the military, just kind of relentless discipline that the military really does instill in you. And also a lot of military teaches you to work with other people. Cause you, you, there's, there's only about group work. There's no ego in the military and maybe a general, not, not on the, on the company level.
And so I think all these things and then always being very concerned about society and where the world is going and, and, know, thinking about things differently was that's how this all came together.
Grant (08:21.206)
Yeah, it's an amazing path. I've talked to so many people who have been on the, let's say nonprofit philanthropy side of solving really complex issues, whether it's poverty alleviation or education in general, or just water scarcity, right? So these big problems that traditionally have been left to NGOs and philanthropists to try to solve. I would say the last three...
Hedvig (08:38.315)
Yeah.
Grant (08:48.758)
years or so, I've really talked to a lot of people who have taken that experience and moved over to the entrepreneurship side and say, you know, I've, they've done the really hard research. They understand the real problems that they're faced. And that's amazing to, you know, if you're going to pitch it for money from a venture capital or something like that, you know, the problem, you know, exactly what needs to be built to solve it. And most of the time, these markets are pretty
Hedvig (08:55.999)
Yeah.
Grant (09:19.042)
And so it's really, it's really, I always love talking to, people coming out of that philanthropic arena, let's say, and coming in and building for -profit businesses from those learnings. So far and wide collective, that seemed to be maybe the catalyst for powered by people. So talk a little bit about far and wide first and kind of what that, what that is and then maybe how that was sort of the catalyst for powered by
Hedvig (09:37.077)
Yes.
Hedvig (09:47.679)
Yeah. So that was the business I started, you know, from my, you know, model house in AJAX, Ontario. And it, you know, I had all these big ideas about how hybrid financing and how we could run things. But I think the way FarnWide was set up was also private investors, really wonderful investors. And they, it was a small business. And I think some of these big ideas as time went by, there
Grant (09:53.538)
Yeah.
Hedvig (10:16.383)
really room for them in the business. so it was very, I mean, it came out of a desire to connect, particularly in the beginning, you know, I've just left Afghanistan. I really want to continue to support Afghanistan and help Afghan artisans and cross people and other vendors access to North American market. And then it kind of grew into Pakistan, Uzbekistan and Africa. and so it kind of ended up, we worked with a lot of different vendors, but I felt it was kind of constrained by the way we set up. And I had met
Alison, I had met through a friend and she was helping me on the design side, because we also realized some of the products needed better design for the North American market. know, Alison in Afghanistan has amazing skills, but I'm not aware necessarily of what people want in the market, but they don't live in. So she came in to, she was very senior. She went in and she could work a little bit with me on some of the designs. And then Ella, I had met, I think we were kind of competitors. mean, Ella had a jewelry business out of Kenya.
Grant (10:54.264)
Yeah. Yep.
Hedvig (11:16.715)
really interesting where she was doing sort of, you know, production amongst thousands of small workshops in one of the big slums. And she really perfected that using technology, really exciting business. I think I noticed her because the handmade space is massive, but it's extremely analog and it really isn't innovative. Still today, it's just not innovative at all. And it really needs to be because so many people depend on it for livelihoods, especially women, really made very many people, rural areas.
Grant (11:34.232)
Yeah.
Hedvig (11:45.449)
also young people in economies that really do need this kind of progress. And Ellen and I, we were sort of competitors and I was really interested in, I thought she was very innovative. And I think in the beginning when I tried to befriend her and I thought, you know, I think she was like, but we are competitors. And I was like, yes, we are, but know, bigger pie and we see things the same way. And you know, what is it, you know, rising tides, rise all ships or whatever, was a saying there. And then she very quickly was like, you're too right.
We helped each other, introduced each other to our investors. then my investors sort of said to me at some point, you have great ideas, but this business is just, there is a limit to the scale of it. Why don't you consider selling part of it off or closing it down? And if you still feel strongly about some of these ideas that we really like that you can't implement in this business, find some great people, co -founders and do this. And if you don't do
We're fine with that too, which is extremely generous because they put money into my business. And so I did that. And then I wrote a concept that I sent to Ella and said, how about this? She was stepping out of her business a few months later. I really, stopped. Yeah, I mean, it took some time and I stopped Ella for years. I mean, really. And she was like, this is a good time. Let's meet once a week. Let's talk about this. And then actually one of my, biggest of my previous investors.
Grant (12:45.548)
Yeah. Sure.
Grant (12:59.05)
so it was good timing, really good timing.
Hedvig (13:12.359)
And a couple of LS investors in her previous business were the first founders in Powered by People. So was really nice that way around. And they were sort of saying, know, I mean, LS business still, she exceeded it and it's still doing extremely well. But I think many investors understand that you might not necessarily have the biggest success or a hit right away. And many entrepreneurs are better the second or third time around. I mean, I think when you are
know, when you are not exiting your business the way you want, you don't feel this way. But I can see that that is really, that is what seasoned investors, they totally understand this. that's a calculation in their portfolio. And so, yeah, very lucky that
Grant (13:55.266)
Yep. So when, so when you try to describe powered by people to other individuals about like, Hey, what is it? What is the mission sort of vision? What is the brand? It's, it's, it's big and sort of scope in what it does. But when you try to give the elevator pitch, let's say, like, what is it? What's the business model and what's ultimately the, what you're trying to achieve.
Hedvig (14:11.861)
Yeah.
Hedvig (14:23.839)
Yeah, I mean, I really liked how you said it was a network. I think it really is, but it is at the core of it. It's a marketplace. It connects buyers, you know, in Europe and North America who wants more sustainable and more unique supply. And that is, you know, not necessarily from big factories, you know, that connects those types of buyers. can both be really big. You know, we work with West Elm, Banana Republic, Macy's, others, and small independent boutiques to this new supply of
businesses, makers, vendors, whatever you want to call them in Latin America, Asia and Africa. And so we make sure that connection, it is a matchmaking, that that's frictionless, that it's as easy to source from one of those companies as it would be to buy from a vendor in China, for example. We also, make money on the connection only when the connection is made. When there is a purchasing order, we take a percentage, cut of that. And then we also offer advance payments
Grant (15:15.17)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.
Hedvig (15:22.379)
the vendor that we call the makers, because often they live in economies where, know, factoring or PO financing, any kind of financing is very rare. And particularly these kinds of companies have a hard time getting financing. And so we've really actually been incredibly successful in the financing. think we have financed, you know, last two years, $16 million worth of orders alone and not everybody takes financing. So, you know, I think you have to, I think that that's well understood in marketplaces now
Grant (15:38.252)
Yeah, I
Grant (15:43.854)
Wow. Yep.
Hedvig (15:49.885)
It's not just the matchmaking. You have to have all the services, both on the vendor and the buyer side that makes it sticky, that make people come back, that makes it worthwhile. so yes, Aussie's transactions and the advance payments, that is our sticking point.
Grant (16:05.888)
And so these artisans are all over the world. And I guess are they, you know, in small villages, rural areas, like you said, in Afghanistan or Kenya or Mexico, wherever they might be, I guess, you know, obviously you don't want to paint a broad brush, but I guess from the artisan maker point of view, what's from their perspective? Like, who are
Where are they at sort of in their life cycle of like, have they been in business for a long time? Are these entrepreneurs that you you train and say, hey, you can make this cool stuff, but can you make this? Like, I guess talk about, not necessarily recruitment because you've had the pipeline from far and wide, it seems like. But I guess talk about like cultivating makers globally. What's the difficulty like and how has that
Hedvig (16:38.981)
Mm -mm.
Hedvig (16:57.289)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I think, you know, on our marketplace, people have to be, makers have to be export ready, which means that they, you know, they can speak English, they understand quality control, they can deliver on time and so forth. But I sort of see it this way. don't know whether the listeners can see this, but it's like, you know, the buyers are at a certain level, you know, and buyers are, they have certain expectations. You can't really change those. And so
The challenge is to get the makers up to the standard where the buyer is. And some makers are already there. They have some experience, they have been in the market, they have sold a little before they want to sell more. And those are the ones that you see on the marketplace. If you log on, those are the ones you see. are ready, they can handle an order. And they are mostly slightly bigger makers, but they could also be very small. I saw last week a
One man show in Nairobi called I Love NBO got a big order with Smithsonian Museum in DC. So there are smaller makers who he probably has distributed network of producers, we've tried to match the makers with the buyers and the size they have. then we have, so there can be really small workshops, but for the West Alms and those, they tend to be a little bit bigger, at least 20 plus, and then they might have
Grant (18:06.563)
Bye.
Grant (18:21.484)
Yep. Sure.
Hedvig (18:26.731)
production network around that. And those are the people that are on the marketplace that people can buy from immediately. And then we have on the bigger platform, we have many more people registered who can benefit from our, we have kind of a learning hub. What does it mean to be export ready? What does it mean to have this kind of pricing? So we go on and provide all kinds of resources for people to learn that. And that's of course, why do we do that? We do that
Grant (18:39.424)
Mmm. Mmm.
Hedvig (18:53.667)
we want to help people, but also because we are trying to create a long tail of people who could be, who's going to be an export ready next year, six months down the line, two years down the line, because that's ultimately how we are going to go and we are going to continue to have the most unique and attractive supply. And that's really where it's interesting, you talked about before, and I totally agree that you see, I think that's the biggest change too, that I see that people who would have started an NGO
Grant (19:00.662)
Yeah.
Hedvig (19:22.539)
10 or 20 years ago, they now can start a business because it's changed and it's business is seen if it's responsible as a way of solving these problems. but I would say we have now reverted back in a sense, we've sort of said, we are a serious venture backed company and our investors understand the business of course, but they also really understand the building of technology, the sales operations, the go -to market, the demand side of the business. They're very familiar with that. What they are a little bit less familiar
is the challenges of our supply. And we've then gone back to philanthropists and said, know, Mascot Foundation, Gates Foundation, you live and said, you want more women connected to the market, you want more youth. We have those people. We can put them into the market, but we can't do it alone. And venture money is not patient. It's just not venture investors aren't great. It's just not structured that way. Right. So, and so we
Grant (20:13.334)
Yep. Yeah, but they can sub.
Yeah, yeah. But you help them, they can subsidize sort of the training maybe for women. And then when they graduate, let's say, they then have the ability to get on your platform to learn a lot more and they sort of become ready. But that training layer, that layer of development, let's say, to get people ready to, you know, whether it's become entrepreneurs, whether it's to even work
maybe one of these factories or something like that, that base layer of investment can't come from venture. That's just not what it's for. But to me, what I've learned is that's almost exactly what philanthropy should be for, almost. And hopefully we're transitioning into a
Hedvig (20:49.981)
Exactly.
Hedvig (20:53.917)
No, no, no.
Hedvig (21:00.427)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know it is.
I think so. I think that's really, you you talked about that you were impressed with us. I mean, I'm so impressed with you and what you do with the core scientists because this is exactly what you are kind of in this space. I feel where you you know, you're kind of highlighting both sides. And I think that it's really important. I've always had this idea of kind of a hybrid business model that, you know, in the sense of hybrid financing, which I feel we are sort of achieving at the moment. have the venture backers
take care of certain things and then we have these philanthropists. And of course, you have to really balance these relationships. You have to really understand how to manage two very different kinds of financing that are restricted in different ways. And the philanthropic side a little bit more restricted, because also these organizations are nonprofit, maximizing and charitable in nature. And so of course you have to respect that and make sure that the money is spent in a way that really supports this. But I think
You, these, we can all learn how that works well. but I, and I think, you know, given what the world looks like, I think, you know, the model that we are trying to tone and, make better and tighter, a lot of businesses could benefit from that. Not just in our space, you know, everywhere. and, you know, I think that's, really becoming important. And I think what I wanted to, to to compliment you on is I think one of the main things for making this model work.
is information on both sides, making the philanthropist and the venture capitalist more comfortable with each other, really making both understand what the other party is trying to achieve, how they can leverage each other. Because in a way, the philanthropists are de -risking some of the investment coming from venture. the other way around, the philanthropists like the venture involved because they know that the venture investor wouldn't have invested without there being
Grant (22:49.792)
Absolutely, absolutely.
Hedvig (23:02.259)
a reasonable chance that this was a really a sustainable model because of course, economic and social and environmental sustainability are all connected. People, our vendors won't be successful if our business isn't successful. And so I think people have so much more in common than what separates them. everybody is, it's like, always say, powered by people in any business, it's like having the perfect dinner party Friday night. If you get all the right people around the table, it's amazing. And the food has to be good too.
Grant (23:30.552)
Yeah. Yes. Yeah.
Hedvig (23:32.031)
you know, maybe a bit of wine, but you know, but this is the same. It's about getting all the same stakeholders. And it is a bit more complex because it's a more diverse group of stakeholders, but our world is also, I would admit, I would say it's getting a little bit more complicated. I mean, when I was a kid, there was also conflicts. didn't know. They weren't as, you know, we didn't get them in on social media feed every day, but we learned about it in newspapers that the environmental layer is much more threatening.
you know, is a much more complicated that we didn't, that wasn't as much focused on in the 70s and 80s. And so I think that it's only natural that these things, the business models and the stakeholder relationships and the stakeholder network is changing and perhaps coming a bit more diverse as everything else in the world
Grant (24:23.064)
Yep, I've been honing in on this word outcome and outcomes for the last six months and trying to understand this landscape where philanthropists or NGOs, they're focused, their outcome is like, guess, poverty alleviation or literacy, maybe it's financial literacy or just reading literacy or whatever it might be.
It's like they have this outcome of, it's just like solving for clean water, right? And it seems like they have been reluctant to kind of de -risk, let's say, you know, venture investing because they had, because VCs might have a, they have a different outcome sort of metric. But I see it where it's like they, like you had mentioned, they can help each other so much to deliver that outcome. And to me it's.
Hedvig (25:13.611)
Stick in,
Grant (25:18.388)
there, instead of the reluctancy to work together for various reasons, right, maybe it's, you philosophical. But if the outcome is what the real North Star is, then these two sort of entities have the ability to produce outcomes. And that is the main objective. And everything else should be relevant. You know, every, everybody's egos and
Hedvig (25:25.717)
Yeah.
Hedvig (25:44.72)
Yeah, yeah, absolutely,
Grant (25:48.202)
know, philosophies are just, are the outcome we are trying to achieve? And I think these two areas of society can work pretty actually hand in hand to get outcomes achieved. And that's what I'm optimistic about. And sort of what motivates me is
Hedvig (25:51.701)
Yeah.
Hedvig (26:06.475)
Yeah. And I just couldn't agree more. I think it is, you know, this hybrid financing model, I've had the idea of this for 15 years. I mean, I'm clearly not the only one, but I've really, I've understood the need that this business could only really work if this happened. And it took me this long, I mean, to make that happen. And I, you know, I think it's not going to take other people as long. And I think, you know, that's back to, you know, my colorful journey, but you know, I think.
I was able to make this work in the end. mean, we, not just me, but we, but we had the, you know, we have the advantage in the business that I had been in economic development. I understood the vernacular of the philanthropist and the, because I used to work for them before I, I, know, and I think that's where some of it comes in because, you know, most philanthropists, you know, they're set up in a way, they have a board, they have a strategy, they have an outcome that they, as a foundation, is trying to achieve. And you really have
You know, as you will have for the venture investors, you have to really think about what, when you go and talk to them about money, think sometimes it's really as simple as language. How can you put your business in a language that makes it easy for them to fund you? You know, how can you look at their strategy, what they're trying to achieve? Because sometimes language can be the divider and it really doesn't have to be because venture language is distinctly different from the language we use
in economic development and philanthropy. But as you agree, the outcome is really often the same. How you get there and some of the tactics. And that's where sometimes things can be hard because, for example, if a philanthropist want to support more access to financing in Kenya, for example, for women, you may not be able to use the same interest rate as you did in the business because they can't make money on that financing. They wanted
Grant (28:01.122)
Sure.
Hedvig (28:03.593)
you risk your ability to go further. And if there is a loss, they will say, well, a certain loss is okay because we want to push the limits and then we learn what works and what doesn't work. And so there is some things in your business model where you will have to negotiate and figure out how you do it. But I think it's about creativity. but, but, you know, so I would say to everybody who's trying to make these models work, try to really look at, spend a bit of time trying to understand who you're trying to raise money for. We do, you do
you spend a lot of money trying to understand what is that fund trying to do? Who have they invested in before? What seemed to really make them interested? Do the same with the philanthropic investors. What does their last board meeting look like? What does their, you know, metric look like? And then try to translate your business into that. I think that some of it is as simple as that.
Grant (28:46.615)
Mm -hmm.
Grant (28:56.14)
Yeah. Yeah. I want to get back to the makers real quick for a minute. What are they actually making? I guess give us an idea of what the products are and what the West Elms of the world are buying. The Smithsonian Institute are buying it all these retailers. I guess what are they looking for and what are these makers creating and building that is really being bought up by these platforms?
Hedvig (29:00.351)
Yeah.
Hedvig (29:11.967)
Yeah.
Hedvig (29:24.373)
Yeah, I think what we have seen success is in people wanting something that's handmade or at least very, very mostly handmade, high quality, good design, more contemporary looking, not maybe as crafty. And so for example, one great example of that is Siafu Home, it's a textile company in Nairobi, Kenya that has
has seen incredible growth in the last couple of years. We sold them into Liberties, into West Elm, and they've made these incredibly beautiful cotton, know, textiles, know, napkins and blankets and tablecloths and placemats, or things like that. the colors are vibrant, it's contemporary design, but it's all, you know, traditional handlooms. So how can you translate these old...
Grant (29:57.987)
Wow.
Grant (30:06.061)
Mm -hmm.
Hedvig (30:20.871)
skills and techniques into a product that looks a bit more contemporary and fresh. We have Itze Wood in the jungle of Guatemala. They work around a paper mill and they take the offcuts of wood and make beautiful things. it's wood that would have been waste. But now it goes into being super beautiful home decor, candle holders and other beautiful.
Grant (30:46.434)
Mm -hmm.
Hedvig (30:51.071)
very contemporary look, they're also both in Liberties and West Elm. And there's so many cases of that. you know, it can be a local group that, you know, that has done well and we've helped them a bit on sort of the elevation and new connections. But also sometimes most people have of course gotten there totally by themselves. And the best thing we could do was to connect them to additional buyers and finance them if they needed that.
It's a very, very vibrant community of really beautiful products and people who really, you know, this, this maker community that can be both quite small makers and, and, know, rural, urban, and can also be relatively big. It's a very sort of beautiful community. People are very helpful to each other. it's obviously by nature because it doesn't require a lot of industrial techniques or it's really very sustainable. mostly uses.
you know, raw materials. And there's not a lot of waste because people actually can't afford to waste. I mean, it's just not. And so it's by nature, you know, and it really is a community that needs just the opportunity. And I think, you know, it's sort of, know, where you have Etsy, which is often makers that are one or two people, they don't actually want to grow Etsy, went into wholesale in 2014 and 13.
Grant (31:52.364)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Hedvig (32:16.821)
but stopped again because many of makers didn't want to grow. This is the size of the business. This is what they were, it was a part -time job. It's a very beautiful community. We are the next level up. If you want to really grow your business and become a full -time entrepreneur, then PBP is your place where you can find, you know, common ground with other people who believe in the things you believe
Grant (32:21.334)
It's a part -time job for them. It's, it's, yeah. Yeah. Yep.
Grant (32:39.054)
How does the maker process work for one to become? Is it inbound, Are they just reaching out to you guys? Okay, and then.
Hedvig (32:47.071)
Yeah, we do both. Lots of people reach out and then we have a due diligence process that has two, anybody can register online and benefit from our webinars and our learning hub and all the things that we do there. Anybody can do that. It's name, company name, email. That's basically it. If you want to sell in the marketplace and be seen by buyers, I should also say you can even before
try to get on the marketplace. can set up a digital profile. can, if you have a buyer somewhere and you want to use our payment rails or our financing, you can create an order, send it to your buyer. So you can actually use our order management system. Anybody can use, anybody's welcome to use that because there isn't a lot of business to business tools in many of these communities. this is, people don't have credit cards. So they can't use some of the things that you and I would use. So anybody can use.
Grant (33:28.278)
Interesting. Great.
Grant (33:34.368)
Yeah, that's great. Yeah.
Hedvig (33:42.431)
platform and our order management tool. If you want to get on the marketplace, do need to see that you are export ready. You can carry a conversation in English around an order. You understand the quality, you understand what the means to deliver on time. So we ask a number of business oriented questions and then we also ask a number of questions associated with ESG. You know, make sure that, because we do want to be a sustainable marketplace. So every maker has to ask
basic number of questions to get on. then most bigger buyers require much more rigor. so we have some assessments that we ask. They are self -reported, but we ask makers to go through a larger number of questions where they answer questions about their social and environmental and governance structure. And so we have that kind of data and we can then share that with some of the bigger clients.
Grant (34:42.296)
Beautiful. I'll end on a couple of questions here. One would be, you know, putting my, let's say e -commerce entrepreneur hat on it. If I, if I wanted to, build, you know, a drop shipping, you know, marketplace, but I'm not a West Elm, right? I'm not like, I'm just a, let's say just a digital entrepreneur. And, know, I spin up a store in Shopify. Can I plug into the powered by people API and get
Hedvig (34:45.717)
Yeah.
Hedvig (34:57.151)
Yeah. Yeah.
Grant (35:10.594)
you know, inventory on my site and then sell as a drop shipper? Is that
Hedvig (35:15.711)
That's exactly what you can. At the moment, it's particularly easy with Shopify and lot of people aren't Shopify's. And so we have a plugin there. You can go on to partbypeople .com. You'll see Dropship, follow the link. And I think it's a great way. I mean, what we saw after COVID was because of all these supply chain disruptions, people saw particularly for bigger buyers, maybe not so much for smaller buyers, but pretty much everyone had at the end of COVID too much inventory because things had come late. And so we realized that people wanted to update their collections.
Grant (35:20.044)
Yep. Easy app. Yeah.
Hedvig (35:45.119)
but maybe didn't have the cash to buy new inventory. so, you know, with Dropship, you can get onto our Dropship catalog. We have, you know, thousands of SKUs. You simply pick those and you can create your own shop with PVP powered SKUs and you're not out of pocket. And it's really easy. So I would encourage people who are interested in that to visit
Grant (35:54.232)
Nice.
Grant (35:59.906)
Yep. Yeah, great.
Grant (36:06.86)
Yes, yes, absolutely. Last question I have is, you you've, you've done so many cool things. You sort of built in this space. You're, you're adding features on here and there. think the financing thing is just such a, such a natural progression, such a smart move by you and the team for the next, let's say five years or so, what are some of the goals and successes you and the team would like to achieve? What does that roadmap sort of look
Hedvig (36:33.995)
I think it's really, you know, obviously scaling the business, growing the business, you know, and that means on both sides getting, you know, many, many more buyers on board, big and small. We are interested in working with everyone who's interested in more sustainable and unique supply. So really scaling that and become, you know, a much, much bigger play relevant, bigger player on the market. If you want more sustainable, unique supply, we really are. We can work with you, big or small, please contact us.
And also on the maker side, think at the moment we are trying to build out our technology to make it as easy as we can for the buyer. Obviously everything starts with an order. Otherwise we can't help anybody on the maker side. But we are also the part of the business I am very involved in is the supply side of the business. And how can we also build out the technology downstream? How can we make it much, how can we build out our technology to make it really easy for any maker anywhere to get online, you know.
Grant (37:13.9)
Sure.
Hedvig (37:32.135)
start using our tools even in the local market because we know that local sales leads to international sales. And so it is the way to get in there. And even if you aren't ready to engage directly with us, how can we provide much better tools for you to be able to grow your business? then, you know, we can follow you once you're on the platform, we can see, and if you use our payment rails, we can see how well you're doing. And as soon as you have a bit more business, we can then lift you into the economy and we really create an ecosystem where
Everybody's welcome and people can get access to more and more services as they move up the value chain. That's really the dream we want to have. And it's going to take another five years to build out these systems. But it's a big sector. We estimate there is 300 million people in our sector. And as I said in the beginning, it is still a surprisingly analog sector. And that really should change. And we're working extremely hard at doing that with an increasing.
know, group of stakeholders who also want to see this happen. So that's really the dream, you know, that we become that default sourcing option for buyers and we become that solution for makers who that on ramp that brings everybody into the market. Because I think the three of us, co -founders, we are extremely motivated. Like, I know you are more equal access to the global market. You globalization hasn't worked for everyone. How can we do better?
Grant (38:44.684)
Yup. Exactly.
Grant (38:58.786)
Yep. Yep. No, I think we're hitting a a good point in time in history. you know, the, obviously the evolution of technology is, is, it's taking a lot of what we need to get done there, but you know, technology is one layer. And I think the financing layer is another massive, huge one. Another huge market of, what a lot of entrepreneurs are working on too, is building that, financial layer, you know, for, for those, you know,
Hedvig (39:07.295)
Jesus.
Hedvig (39:13.673)
It
Grant (39:27.256)
couple billion people that don't have access to that, maybe even more than that, that don't have access to that financial layer that is obviously pretty foundational to any economy that needs to be built. And especially the entrepreneurship and creative economy needs that financial layer of, you know, even something, you know, like payments, you know, not even talking about credit or, or anything like that, like simple, just payments and the ability to get paid fast and have these data tools
Hedvig (39:28.949)
Yeah, absolutely.
Hedvig (39:43.007)
Absolutely.
Hedvig (39:47.209)
Absolutely. I know.
Grant (39:56.802)
Look at that business, think another beautiful thing is enabling these makers to almost use Power by People as their sort of backend dashboard for their business, which is another layer of revenue that's possible for you guys too, you know, right? I mean, that's
Hedvig (40:05.363)
Absolutely.
Hedvig (40:10.763)
And that's really what we're seeing. mean, I think we, yes, we have a marketplace today, but will we have a marketplace in five years? I mean, I think what we are really hoping is we can bring people into the market on our operating system. And then, you know, this omnichannel, that people's own e -commerce of various platforms, maybe even competitive platforms that people can sell on. I think the future is where you sell multiple places. How can we enable that and
that increasingly easy. That's really, that's our goal. You know, there's this highway, how do we get everybody on the highway and how can we make multiple revenue streams and sales channels possible for people? That's,
Grant (40:51.916)
Absolutely. Well, thank you so much for taking the time. This was amazing conversation. I knew it would be. I've been a fan of what you and Allison and have built for a while. I'm glad we finally got to do this. Best of luck to you and the team for the next decade to come. Keep up the amazing
Hedvig (41:10.635)
Thank you so much. And I also really want to thank you. I'm so happy when I saw you launched and I think you really are a great force for bringing everybody together. And we haven't really had this. There's not a lot of champions. That's one thing I think this, all of us who have this vision is missing. No matter what sector you're in, it's people who can sort of highlight the opportunities and bring people together. That's key, I think. So I really want to thank you for giving us all light.
Grant (41:40.938)
Amazing. Thank you. Awesome.
Hedvig (41:41.22)
Even when we hadn't met, so appreciate it.
